Asymmetrical Information

Tom Hanks? All-American, quotable, palatable across the spectrum.

“Tom Hanks? All-American, quotable, palatable across the spectrum.”

Nope, Tom Hanks is a major star. Ronald Reagan was merely a second echelon actor. The real answer to Jane Galt’s question is nobody! Hollywood no longer finances the type of films Reagan made. You either earn your way out of the minor leagues---or your career is finished. When was the last time you saw Tom Selleck in a big screen movie?

It turned out that Ronald Reagan was a far better President than actor. In the former role, he was among the greatest in history.

David, I'm not sure I agree that an actor becomes "big-time" or disappears. Look at Ed Harris. No one pitches a movies using his name as a selling point. As to Hollywood not making the minor, B-movie type of film, true. That's what television is for.

Reagan worked for the B unit at Warner Brothers, and B pictures don't exist anymore; the big studios don't waste their time. The closest things B-level features nowadays are usually small indie crime flicks and "erotic thrillers" featuring Gary Busey or the like, but these are far too gritty for Reagan's style.

The optimistic morality tales like The Winning Team are now handled by made-for-TV movies, and the Saturday matinee stuff like Desparate Journey is now given an A-budget and taken seriously.

If there's an equivilant to Reagan today, he's probably making TV movies, playing perfect fathers and the like. (If he were still alive I might say Michael Landon.)

I should quickly add that Ronald Reagan’s last movie was probably “The Killers (1964)” where he portrayed the thug who *slapped Angie Dickinson. His leading days were long behind him. The Hollywood producers perceived him as only a supporting actor.

*There were rumors that Reagan caught Dickinson reading Betty Friedan (1963). The Feminine Mystique. Sigh, I can’t find any supporting evidence to back up this claim.

William H. Macy - star of Fargo, and a lot of indie films. Moves between TV & films, like RR did. Not a big star, but works a lot.

“David, I'm not sure I agree that an actor becomes "big-time" or disappears. Look at Ed Harris. “

Ed Harris is a far better actor than Reagan could ever hope to be. Also, most of the time Harris is cast in a supporting role. His superb portrayal in “Pollock” was something of an exception.

“No one pitches a movies using his name as a selling point.”

That’s patently false! Ever hear of Tom Cruise?

“As to Hollywood not making the minor, B-movie type of film, true. That's what television is for.”

I don’t think Jane was thinking of made for TV films.

PS: Ed Harris is also politically a jerk, but that’s not relevant to this discussion. We are still obligated to recognize his greatness as an actor.

“William H. Macy - star of Fargo, and a lot of indie films. Moves between TV & films, like RR did. Not a big star, but works a lot.”

An Indie film also doesn’t count. Ronald Reagan was on the second rung of the Hollywood food chain. Indie films are not even made in Hollywood! Just ask Robert Redford who started something called the Sundance Institute.

I don't know about Reagan (before my time, alas); but there's more to cinema than Hollywood and TV. Lots of good indie flicks come out every year, making the rounds of festivals and art houses, and not all of them are impenetrable art-snob projects. Movies like "Following" and "Memento", both by Chris Nolan; The "Man Who Wasn't There", by the Coen Bros.; The "Secret Lives of Altar Boys"; "Pi"; and "My First Mister" are all fine films and can be rented from Netflix or a well-stocked local video rental shop. Maybe Hollywood doesn't make B movies any more; but that doesn't mean they aren't being made.

I'll cast my vote for Bill Pullman: leading man, solid, but not quite A-list

Tom Cruise. Not exactly the same kinds of films, of course, but they don't make the same kinds of films these days. But he's pretty close, I think.

I'll second for Pullman.

Bob

Or maybe Harrison Ford?

Bill Pullman was the first name that came to my mind, too.

He's a leading man, he's been in a handful of popular movies, he keeps working, but he's never the reason you go see a flick.

WRT comments on Reagan's acting talent:

Gore Vidal, of all people, was quite adamant that Reagan was an excellent actor whose abilities were not showcased as they might have been because the studio system of his (and Vidal's) era dictated that he be given a limited range of roles.

Acting-wise, who would be the modern-day equivalents of Ronald Reagan? This is not an invitation to share your opinions on his religious or political views; rather, what actors make the same sort of films, and enjoy the same level of name recognition, as The Gipper did during his movie career?

Bruce Boxleitner
Dirk Benedict
Corbin Bernson
William Shatner
David Caruso

Bill Pullman's a good one, yeah. Matthew McConaughey and Ben Affleck are two other likely candidates.

I'll throw in a vote for Kevin Spacey or Kevin Bacon but like Ed Harris they are more likely to show up as supporting cast rather than leads. That might be pretty accurate for Regan, though, because I recall he wasn't cast as the male leading man in his biggest pictures. I agree there really aren't b-movies made any more, and I'm not familar enough with made-for-tv flics to know if there is a male lead that generally shows up there. I'm dating myself :) but I suppose you could say Richard Chamberlain might have been at Regan's level back in the '80s. He was a regular lead in tv miniseries but I don't think he ever made it big on the silver screen.

Harrison Ford has much more star power as a box office draw than Regan ever did, IMO.

Here's his filmography; it's just an endless series of B-movies. I can't think of any modern parallels.

We'd have to look in direct-to-video releases to find today's equivalent of B-movies, wouldn't we? Or maybe to made-for-TV-movies? Sadly, that would probably mean we'd all have to suggest people like "that guy in that one show who did that thing," which probably doesn't help the conversation much.

I don't know if the analogy is right, but I've always wanted to say: Shatner for President. Can you imagine the State of the Union address?

I'm not sure what "the same type of films" means. I mean, nobody is exactly making Bedtime for Bonzo these days.

But big name guys who are 1) well known, 2) generally liked, 3) but not John Wayne/Clark Gable leading man types:

Kevin Kline
Danny DeVito
Morgan Freeman

Probably lots of others

Cuba Gooding, Jr. (esp. recent work, incl. Snow Dogs, Rat Race & Boat Trip).

Agree that Bill Pullman and Kevin Bacon are good choices too.

Kevin Pollack, 'cept without the whole jewish thing.

I think a B actor like Reagan would be doing mostly TV sitcoms and TV movies today. I'm thinking Alan Thicke... A lot of movies you've never heard of, TV movies, and of course one big hit TV series.
http://us.imdb.com/Name?Thicke,+Alan

A Shatner-delivered SotU address would be a howler, but also interminable. You could sell commercial time in the caesuras.

Though, I think Pullman, Bacon, Harris and the list that included Boxleitner and Caruso are all good choices, but I think had not the first Terminator been such a hit and made him such a star, Arnie would be a candidate.

Most of Arnie's fims involved low concept action films (Commando, Raw Deal, Predator) and sci-fi concept movies (Total Recall, Running Man, even the first Terminator, was a suprise hit relased with little fanfare starring unknown actors, which even Arnie was at the time.) are analogous to Reagan's B-movies. What changed was the tastes and preferences of moviegoers in the mid 80's that made what would have been B-movies in the 60s became blockbusters in the mid 80's.

Mathematically, in my opinion, a leading role in a B movie equates to a supporting role in a modern blockbuster.

Ed Harris, Morgan Freeman, Bill Pullman are all good, but in my mind there is only one true choice: Kevin Bacon.

Mathematically, in my opinion, a leading role in a B movie equates to a supporting role in a modern blockbuster.

Ed Harris, Morgan Freeman, Bill Pullman are all good, but in my mind there is only one true choice: Kevin Bacon.

Hate to break it to you, but Shatner's Canadian. Shatner for Prime Minister?

Hate to break it to you, but Shatner's Canadian. Shatner for Prime Minister?

Pullman's an excellent choice...and he's already been President (in "Independence Day")!

B-movie actor?

Wings Hauser

Tom Cruise and Tom Hanks, two of the biggest box office draws of our time, are not Reagan's league.

I will admit that Tom Hanks was at one point this kind of actor. Before Apollo 13, before Forrest Gump. In the days of Big.

And Mel Gibson is also too famous, before anyone suggests him. Think smaller, people!

As for Harrison Ford... actors who play franchise characters are an interesting category. Harrison Ford, Sean Connery (and the other Bonds) all have pretty high fame, but it is related to one role (two for Harrison). Not sure if they make good comps to a Reagan.

I second Bill Pullman (who is *excellent* by the way) and William H. Macey. Slightly less vocal seconds for Kevin Spacey and Kevin Bacon.

I'm not sure about Matthew McConaughey and Ben Affleck -- they're young enough that they might end up being huge huge stars. Was Reagan a hunky sex symbol?

Now for the important part, new names:

* John Cusack *

* Ben Stiller *
(Royal Tenenbaums, Meet the Parents, There's Something About Mary, Reality Bites, Zero Effect)

* Greg Kinnear *
(As Good As it Gets, Sabrina, Nurse Betty, What Planet Are You From?)

* Val Kilmer *
(Top Secret, Real Genius, Tombstone)

* Gene Hackman *
(Birdcage, Royal Tenenbaums, The Firm, French Connection, Bonnie & Clyde)

* Brad Pitt *
(Sleepers, Oceans Eleven, The Mexican, Seven, Legends of the Fall, Fight Club)

Longshots:

* Hugh Grant *
(Four Weddings and a Funeral, About a Boy)

* Rick Moranis *
(My Blue Heaven, Spaceballs, Ghostbusters, Little Shop of Horrors, Honey I Shrunk the Kids, Brewster's Millions)

* Steve Gutenberg *
(Three Men and a Baby, Short Circuit, Police Academy, Cocoon)

And my longshot second is Alan Thicke.

Here's his filmography; it's just an endless series of B-movies. I can't think of any modern parallels.

Most modern movies would have been considered "B" movies in Reagan's day. They just have "A" budgets.

“Here's his (Reagan’s) filmography; it's just an endless series of B-movies. I can't think of any modern parallels.”

There are no modern parallels because today’s Hollywood producers are willing to take more risks to get a chance at a bigger pay day. Even if one factors in the inflation factor---today’s movies probably cost far more than those of Reagan’s era. No guts, no glory, is the way the present day investors see the matter.

“...even the first Terminator, was a surprise hit released with little fanfare starring unknown actors, which even Arnie was at the time.) are analogous to Reagan's B-movies. “

Today’s special effects make all the difference. The films of yesterday couldn’t even begun to compete. Have we already forgotten “The Ten Commandments” where they used a fan blowing on Jell-O for the great parting of the Nile River scene? That particular Charlton Heston movie was not a small budget flick!

“Here's his (Reagan’s) filmography; it's just an endless series of B-movies. I can't think of any modern parallels.”

There are no modern parallels because today’s Hollywood producers are willing to take more risks to get a chance at a bigger pay day. Even if one factors in the inflation factor---today’s movies probably cost far more than those of Reagan’s era. No guts, no glory, is the way the present day investors see the matter.

“...even the first Terminator, was a surprise hit released with little fanfare starring unknown actors, which even Arnie was at the time.) are analogous to Reagan's B-movies. “

Today’s special effects make all the difference. The films of yesterday couldn’t even begun to compete. Have we already forgotten “The Ten Commandments” where they used a fan blowing on Jell-O for the great parting of the Nile River scene? That particular Charlton Heston movie was not a small budget flick!

Bruce Boxleitner, Dirk Benedict, Corbin Bernson, William Shatner, Alan Thicke, Steve Gutenberg,
Rick Moranis

All of these might have been good choices 15-20 years ago. Not now.

Wm H. Macy--too quirky; Val Kilmer--too moody; Brad Pitt--too hot; Hugh Grant--British accent gives too much gravitas.

I thought of Ben Stiller, and Greg Kinnear's not bad either, but I still have to go for Cuba Gooding (with honorable mention to Pullman and Bacon) for combination of (1) right kind of films, (2) name-recognition without A-list status, and (3) (nearly) universal likeability.

I looked at Jane's question, looked away and thought "Bill Pullman"

I think it has to do with Jack Warner's comment "No, no. Jimmy Stewart for governor, Ronald Reagan for best friend" when he heard about Reagan going into politics.

This meme is going critical! ;)

> Was Reagan a hunky sex symbol?

I think so. Based on a "Burns and Allen" episode I heard on an old-time radio show. Reagan guest-starred as himself, and was presented as competition for the resident ladykiller. I remember it because his image then was very different from what I was used to!

> Shatner for President

When Reagan announced he was running, one of the studio heads responded, "No, no, Henry Fonda for President, Ronald Reagan for best friend."

How about Brendan Frazier. A well-liked, handsome, B-list actor that sometimes works with monkeys...

Count me in as undecided between Bill Pullman (regretably, I can't recall the director/producer who said "Why should I spend $20M for [fill in major A-list star] when I can get Bill Pullman for $1M?") and Brendan Fraser. I'm a big Brendan fan: I can totally understand why women find him sexy, but he's not the least bit intimidating. I have the sense that he'd make a good friend. Plus he's a fellow Hoosier.

You know, I should add John McGinley to the list. He's one of those steady working actors whom you've seen a dozen times, but probably don't know his name. God knows I didn't when I ran into him at a restaurant in Santa Monica. I stupidly asked "Weren't you the doctor in 'Fat Man and Little Boy?'" He beamed and said "You know, I think you and I were the only ones who saw that film." Nice guy, very down to earth, won an award for Dean Koontz's "Intensity" on HBO if memory serves me correctly. Currently starring on "Scrubs."

Call me stupid, but my very first impression was Brad Pitt. Sure, he's a "big" star, but most of his movies are wildly overrated critically and I wouldn't put it past him to work with a monkey. I suppose he would have to learn to speak in complete sentences.

Drat... I was going to say Bill Pullman...how about Bill Paxton or Gary Sinise? You hear their names and you get a flash of recognition as a movie star, but I doubt many of you would come up with their names if someone just said "Name five male movie stars".

Drat... I was going to say Bill Pullman...how about Bill Paxton or Gary Sinise? You hear their names and you get a flash of recognition as a movie star, but I doubt many of you would come up with their names if someone just said "Name five male movie stars".

Of course there is always Matt Dillon. He's an actor like Ed Harris:

1. Always in a film or two every year, mostly good (or at least decent) ones.

2. NO ONE uses his name to sell the money-men on the production.

3. You absolutley know his face.

4. Doesn't seem like a dumb guy.

I agree that Bill Pullman and Greg Kinnear are excellent choices. I'd also like to suggest Dennis Quaid. But damn Mumblix for posting my "how come no-one's said him yet?!?" idea: I think Gary Sinise is the perfect answer to this question.

Dodd: "I think Gary Sinise is the perfect answer to this question."

I was going to post that last nite but was too lazy and I'm pretty sure Sinise's politics aren't much like Reagan's. Also, I'm basing it on the fact that they both got their legs cut off in famous roles, which maybe isn't soundest of bases for comparison.

Gary Sinise recently apeared on Sean Hannity's show and at a live event promoting same, so I'd say he isn't that far away from the Reagan fold. He's certain;y more of a conservative than than the average run of Hollywood types.

Have we already forgotten “The Ten Commandments” where they used a fan blowing on Jell-O for the great parting of the Nile River scene?

Good God, David, what are you, some kind of bright?!?     :-O

Nobody has mentioned Jeff Daniels. He starred in that TV movie about George Washington, and supported in movies like Pleasantville and Speed.

Sure, Reagan was no Tom Hanks or Bruce Willis or Ahnold, but he had a recognizable name. Maybe because Hollywood was smaller back then, or because everybody went to the movies more. Can anyone imagine, say, Ed Harris appearing as himself in a sitcom?

Reagan was a regular B-movie star, which probably put him up in the top 20 most recognizable actors; maybe even top 10. In terms of recognition, I'm don't think Bill Pullman makes the top 20, let alone Gary Sinise or Ed Harris (for all that I think they've done great work).

I guess the bottom line is, things have changed to much to do a reasonable comparison.

The film industray is definitely a very different place today and television as well as the substantial direct to cable/video industries must be taken in consideration.

Reagan did get a certain amount of promotion to the then teenage girls of America. A recently published book recounts how such a young girl became taken with Reagan in 1947 and started a correspondance with him that continued for over a decade. He apparently had a remarkable number of pen pals. Had he been born a few decades later he'd likely have been an incorrigible usenet junkie.

http://www.jewishworldreview.com/0203/steigerwald020603.asp

"Have we already forgotten “The Ten Commandments” where they used a fan blowing on Jell-O for the great parting of the Nile River scene?

Good God, David, what are you, some kind of bright?!?     :-O"

Gulp, I think we now know why I flunked Sunday School. I was wondering why Jerry Fallwell and I were not on a first name basis.

“I guess the bottom line is, things have changed to (too) much to do a reasonable comparison.”

They have indeed changed far too much “to do a reasonable comparison.” Today’s Hollywood producers are not satisfied with the profits normally earned in the past. My guess is that the tax deductions of our present era entice investors to take more risks. That’s it in a nutshell.

I find myself oddly in agreement with Jason McCullough; there's no modern parallel. Reagan's skill (or lack thereof) as an actor is almost a moot point; he appeared in a long string of B-movies that didn't demand much in the way of talent.

More recent parallels might include George Kennedy, who nearly always (with notable exception in Cool Hand Luke) appeared in second-rate movies.

Call me stupid, but my very first impression was Brad Pitt. Sure, he's a "big" star, but most of his movies are wildly overrated critically and I wouldn't put it past him to work with a monkey. I suppose he would have to learn to speak in complete sentences.

I thought Brad Pitt was spectacular in Fight Club. Could be just a good fit for him, though. The best thing I've ever witnessed out of him was his responses during a Terry Gross interview. She asked him something about his views on Tibet as regards China (reference to his movie Seven Years in Tibet) and his response was something like: "I really don't know much about that sort of thing. I'm just a guy playing a role." He went up in my estimation because although he's no rocket scientist, he's wise enough to know what he doesn't know.

Cuba Gooding, Jr. univerally liked? Has everyone forgotten his wretched Pepsi One commercials?

Perhaps. We all seem to have forgotten Pepsi One :)

Steve Buscemi.

Brian Dennehy.

Charles Durning.

Holly Hunter.

Ewan McGregor.

Robert Carlyle.

Don't know about Reagan, but his co-star in the "Bongo" films has a doppelganger in the current White House resident. (sorry about the partisan swipe, but couldn't resist)

I think, perhaps, we're focusing on men too much, though I know that was Jane's intent.

Being a B-movie actor, to me, implies an actor of at best average ability doing unoriginal films that are at best reliable money makers at little expense.

As such, it would leave out actors like Sinise, Cusack, and Hackman, all of whom are highly talented and often do creative, off-beat, very dramatic films.

Greg Kinear is a good choice, but even he has attempted some risky roles.

Someone like Schwarzenegger, who is untalented, still does very expensive, very grandiose films.

I'm going to suggest that the only comporable modern person is someone like Meg Ryan, who is entertaining, likeable, a reliable money-maker, but nevertheless makes pretty much the same romantic comedy time after time (with the one exception of that disappointing war/murder mystery flick she did.)

I want to also ad that it may be hard finding a modern Reagan, or a modern anyone, because (and I know this is controversial) today's actors are really far more talented than those of the golden years.

Although those older actors are good, they tended to play very similar roles. Jimmy Stewart was the wholesome, strong but quiet type; Bogart was the mysoginistic, strong but quiet type; Peck was the noble, strong but quiet type; Wayne was the rugged, strong but quiet type; Cary Grant was the vaguely Euro, vaguely gay, vaguely funny strong but quiet type.

But then came James Dean, Marlon Brando, Robert DeNiro, Jack Nicholson, and Al Pacino. These guys could, and did, play roles far beyond the talents of the earlier guys.

And I think the pop-star crowd that came out in the 80s is equally talented: Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise, John Cusack. The bar is set much higher today, despite all the complaints about how cookie-cutter Hollywood is. That's why it's so hard to find another Ronald Reagan.

I would say Michael Ironside, but unfortunately I just discovered that he is canadian. Maybe we should get started on the constitutional amendment, since we are going to have to have one for arnold anyway.

Bruce Boxleitner
Greg Kinnear
Bill Pullman
Matthew Perry
Christian Slater

This is digging back a ways, but: Clint Eastwood.

Definitely Brendan Frazier!

I'll vote the Pullman/Kinnear ticket.

Some commenters may never have seen a Reagan movie. He was a handsome, easygoing lead actor with some charisma, medium dramatic skills, and a light touch in comedy. Excellent physique but unconvincing in action, like Roger Moore.

Luke Wilson; Owen's too funny. Cuba Gooding.

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